Just Between Coaches – Episode 142
Conquer Imposter Syndrome and Build a Dream Business (Jim Palmer)
Jim Palmer: The thing that I’m doing with my clients is I’m getting them focused on serving their clients from an authentic position. But I give them a good brand and give them, you know, some good marketing to do that. And I think if I can get them to buy into the marketing or the brand, I help them create based on their skills, the imposter syndrome starts to go away.
Melinda Cohan: What if I told you that imposter syndrome could be the very thing holding you back from charging the true value and transformation that you deliver? For so many coaches, that nagging doubt and fear of being found out leads to underpricing their services even when they know the impact they create is life changing. But how does this self-doubt creep in? And what can you do to overcome it?
I’m Melinda Cohan and you’re listening to Just Between Coaches. I run a business called the Coaches Console, and we’re proud to have helped tens of thousands of coaches create profitable and thriving businesses. This is a podcast where we answer burning questions that newer coaches would love to ask a more experienced coach. For newer coaches, finding confidence to price their services appropriately can feel overwhelming, especially when imposter syndrome is quietly at play. But today, my guest is here to help us break through those barriers. We’ll explore practical strategies to overcome self-doubt and start charging based on the value and transformation that you provide. You don’t want to miss this.
Joining me today is Jim Palmer, founder of Dream Business Academy, creator of the Dream Business Mastermind and Coaching Program, and host of Dream Business Radio, a podcast on smart marketing and Building Your Dream Business. He’s also the author of seven amazing books on business growth. So welcome to the show, Jim.
Jim: Hey, how you doing, Melinda? Thanks for having me.
Melinda: I am so excited to have you on the show and dive into this conversation. Would you mind sharing the little bit of your background with our audience?
Jim: Yeah. So, you know, I’m getting ready to retire in a couple of months, but skip back 25 years, I was a VP of marketing and my position had been eliminated. I still had four teenagers at home. I really needed to find a salary and insurance and things like that, but that was a 15-month struggle. And in the 12th month, I was diagnosed with stage two melanoma. I felt like my whole life was falling apart. I had done pretty well being a VP by the time I was 40, but then there was no jobs coming. And then I prayed for guidance and the Lord told me to become an entrepreneur. I was like, really? I’m broke. I’m in debt right now.
But I started my first business and took me a year to get my first client. So again, another year, I call that my revenue for a year. But then I was off to the races, and in about five years, I was doing about $300,000. And then I started growing a second business, a third business somewhere around 2009. I was part of different masterminds and going to different events and live events. And some entrepreneurs were like asking me, how are you doing this? And I remember a mentor of mine, Dan Kennedy said, if somebody wants to pick your brain or ask for your advice, you may have a coaching.
So I started Dream Business Mastermind and Coaching Program. And somewhere, I think it was about 2014, I created Dream Business Academy. I did eight sold out events around the country probably up till about 2019. And that’s the short version of 25 years of being an entrepreneur.
Melinda: In those 25 years, let’s go back to the early days. In today’s conversation, we’re going to talk about the imposter syndrome. We’re going to talk about pricing, how they might connect together. But take us back 25 years. The one year of no revenue or however you said it, you just let it roll off your tongue.
Jim: My revenue free year?
Melinda: Yeah, the revenue free year. Like no big deal, it’s how it’s supposed to be. Take us back into that year. How did the imposter syndrome, was that a thing for you as you were starting your business, especially never having done this before and the situation you were in and not making any money? What was the impact of the impostor syndrome?
Jim: I didn’t know what it was at the time. I kind of later learned the terminology. But when I started my business, I was in our dining room on an old Acer computer and that that was it. And I managed to get free business cards from Vistaprint just really starting on the down low. And in that time period it wasn’t in vogue or cool to have a home office. Everybody wants a home office now, right? Back then, one of my fears was that I was going to be found out that I’m just an unemployed guy who just got over cancer and is broken in debt. And I’ve got an old computer and I’m starting my business even though it says president on my business card. President of what?
As many sales calls I went on and doors that I knocked on, nobody asked me, are you operating out of your spare bedroom? Nobody ever said that. I was afraid they were going to say that because I thought you needed an office space and a receptionist and all this and that. It only happened once. Well, where’s your office? I said, oh, it’s over by the turnpike. Oh, in the Eagle View Corporate Center? No, it’s one street short of that. But I was like, oh, I’m sweating. So that was my first experience with imposter syndrome. The second time is when I was undercharging like a lot of people do for your services. Because I’m a self-described self-taught hack at desktop publishing.
I have to hire editors and proofreaders because I know a lot, but I can’t spell and I never learned how to type. So I hire editors to make my thoughts fairly accomplished. But all of that leads to people not being bold enough and feeling the courage to charge what they’re worth.
Melinda: Well, it’s interesting, you know, the way imposter syndrome shows up with all the coaches that I’ve supported starting their business over the past 20 years. That always only lives in our head. It’s never a reality.
Jim: Right.
Melinda: I went through a lot of different coach trainings. I went and got some classes through Coach U, some different classes through CTI, and I kind of piece my, my training together, but I never got certified. My business partner did, but I didn’t. And everybody was like, how can you not be certified? Nobody’s going to take you seriously. I’ve never had anybody ask me about my credentials. They wanted to know, am I qualified, am I capable, can I support them? I could say that with confidence because I did have the training, I did have the classes, but I didn’t go for that piece of paper that said you have these letters behind your name.
That’s another area where I see the imposter syndrome. When I get this certification, I will take myself seriously or people will take me seriously. The only time I’ve really seen people ask about credentials specifically is if they’re the type of client that require that in order for them to sign up for that particular training. But like you, I didn’t really have anybody that asked about it. And so I operated the way I was operating. I had a sofa table that my laptop would barely fit on and a little dining room chair. And that was my office on the side wall of the living room. And that was it. And yeah, it was so freeing. It’s like, wow, this is where I go to work.
What were some of the things that you put into place early on to make sure those voices didn’t get the best of you?
Jim: I knew what I was doing. In other words, my first business was a newsletter business because I had started my first newsletter when I was 21 years old. It worked really well and every kind of position I had, I was in marketing, but I knew how to communicate with customers so they come in and buy more, refer more, et cetera. Probably the sixth customer that my new business had was a very large chamber of commerce. Other than that, I was working with chiropractors like solopreneurs. But this large chamber of Commerce, like 2,000 members, had heard of me through my networking.
And they said, we’d like you to do our newsletter. It’s like a 20-page newsletter and we’d like it to be in color. I didn’t know how to design in color. I’d always done black and white. And I said, you could probably save money if we just do black. No, we want it to be in color. I said, okay. I left there with a new client. I called up my friend who was a printer. I said, I got to come over and sit with your designer. Why? I don’t know how to do it in color. Back then, I just said yes to so many things and figured it out later that my seventh book was called Just Say Yes. But just saying yes is really the key to unlocking so much of that.
The thing that really holds people back, this imposter syndrome is rooted in not charging what you’re fully worth for having transformed one of your client’s lives. When you think of what you do as a transformation, not a task, not how many calls do I get, not how many emails you respond to, none of that. The transformation that you can bring to a potential client, that’s where the real money’s worth. When you know the value that you bring to that client relationship, it’s like Popeye eating his spinach. You get the muscles, you significantly increase your price, and you’re like, oh my gosh, I just made $5,000 more than I did the last client. And I’m doing the same work, right?
Melinda: Yeah. And they don’t even buck. Our students are like, oh, my gosh. I said, my new rates. And they didn’t even bat an eye.
Jim: That’s right.
Melinda: And it always surprises them. I love what you just said. Thinking about what you do as transformation and not a task. I love the title of your book, Just Say Yes. In the early days, we had a colleague, my business partner was talking with her and she said, I think there’s a lot of opportunities where we can support one another. Do you want a JV partner together? And my business partner, much like you, she’s like, yes. Kate hangs up the phone. She’s like, Melinda, what is a JV partner? I was like, I don’t know. But we’ll figure it out and we’ll do it. Whatever it takes to be in service to our people.
Jim: Yeah.
Melinda: Right? That was our mantra. Whatever it takes to help our people stop struggling with whatever they’re dealing with. We can figure it out. We’re figure it out people. Say more about that. It’s not a task, but it’s transformation.
Jim: Yeah, I got a great story because it really speaks about transformation. I can’t say the name, but about three years ago, a coach in high end sales training, fairly well known, said, Jim, I followed you for a while. You got a great reputation, blah, blah, blah, but this is what I’m doing. And on our initial call he said, I’ve got a 90-day program. I don’t get with people for a year or two. I can fix them in 90 days. I said, what do you get for that? He goes, $7,500. And I said, that’s a good fee for 90 days, $3,500.
What do you do for them? Give me an example of somebody you just work with. And he told me it was like a mortgage broker. And he worked with them for 90 days and he helped them add another $100,000 in revenue. And I said, Dave, not his name. I said, Dave, so let me ask you something. So he paid you $7,500, a very healthy fee for 90 days work and he’s now bringing in another hundred thousand dollars in revenue. And he goes, yeah. I said, how’s that fair? How is that a good equity for the time and energy? Because it is 90 days, but took you years and decades to get to the point where you could tell him what to do, how to script, how to change, how to answer, how to do all this stuff. And he brings in $100,000.
He goes, wow, I see your point. And so what do we do? I said, first of all, we reshaped his 90-day program to be 120. There’s a couple different options. I wanted people to have either an A or a B option. They’re always going to select the faster, higher growth, so they’ll select A. He says, what do you think ought to go maybe to $10,000 or $12,000? I said, let’s go with $17,500. The next two people close at $17,500, same program. Then we ultimately went up to $27,500. Now we literally just closed the deal for $75,000. It’s a six-month program. But $75,000.
The thing that people need to understand is people pay for transformation. They don’t pay for the number of calls. They pay for transformation. Dan Kennedy said it doesn’t matter if you’re selling a product or service. What people want most is hope and certainty. Whether they’re struggling and they want to not struggle, or they got a $5 million business and they want to do 10 or 12. If they feel certain that you’re the person that has the skill set, if they hope you take them as a client, if you can position yourself that way, they’re going to be wanting for you instead of you chasing them.
That’s very powerful. Dan calls it price elasticity. It’s a little bit hard, Melinda, when you’re starting out to charge $17,500 for 90 days. But you do need to understand the value that you’re bringing with your skill set and your talent. What you’re doing as far as transforming your client’s business. It has nothing to do with when you look at somebody’s website, all the green checkmarks, two calls a month. We’re going to do support; we’re going to do a group call. If I say yes, how will my business be different? That’s why they’ll say yes. If it’s positioned correctly and they understand the value of saying yes. Like, if the value is, I’m going to help you bring in another fifty or a hundred thousand, then ten thousand dollars is not that much money, right, because that’s a pretty big ROI.
Melinda: Right. Another way that I love to look at this, when I’m helping my clients, I’ve got a pricing matrix that I help them look at it from a lot of different angles. The more angles, the more confident they can be in the value being exchanged. And so one of the questions I’ll have them answer is, if this person that could benefit from your services, if they don’t make any change, what are the negative ripple effects and how is that going to impact their lives negatively?
And when a coach can start answering that, they’re like, oh, my gosh, this could happen and this might be in place. It doesn’t matter the niche, health coach, business coach, relationship coach, you can do it for all of them. I find that when they start seeing the negative implications, if somebody doesn’t make changes, I find that it’s an inspiration. It’s like, wow, I’ve got to make sure I can do whatever I need to do, get courageous enough, be bold enough to say what I need to say. It almost always melts away that imposter syndrome. It’s like I can figure myself out. It’s about them.
Jim: Right. Everything you said is correct. I’ll do one caveat, though. When it’s like, if you don’t do this, that’s kind of a it’s almost like a challenge. You can do this or not do this. One of the things I’ve learned to say as I’ve gotten more confident, I said, I know I can help you do this, and I won’t even break a sweat. That’s my line to make it seem like it’s going to be effortless. And then I’ll say, I want to tell you a quick story. I once worked with a client who said all the right things. Passed all my tests of, like, because I only work with people that want to be highly successful. I work with people who are going to do the work. I work with people who understand the transformation that’s going to happen.
So there’s no link to sign up. I have to have this, usually a couple conversations before somebody can work with me. But this person somehow got under my radar. I said, here’s five things we’re going to do. They did 1 and 2, half of 3, and said, 4 and 5 won’t work for me. And then at the end, it goes, well, this didn’t work right. So I need you to understand, if we’re going to do these five things, you got to be all in. Like, not to say we can’t tweak slightly, but you really have to own it and be in it to win it. So I just want to make sure I don’t think you’re that person. Oh, I’m not that person.
They don’t want to be associated with the little story you just told, which in most cases, 100% real, because we all have those cases. If they want to work with you, you accept them as a client. Then when I say, okay, time to write a book or it’s time to do your podcast. Jim, I really don’t want to do a podcast. I got a silly voice. I laugh. I don’t know how to interview people. I don’t know who would want to be on my show, and I can help lower that. That’s part of being a good coach, as I’m sure you know, Melinda.
That’s a difference between being in cash flow mode, which we all are when we start, and being in a mode where you start shifting to, these are the clients I want to work with. These are the clients that want to work with me, that’s when your prices go up, you get more referrals, et cetera.
Melinda: I love that distinction. It’s an important distinction. Now, one of the other analogies that I use when things like the imposter syndrome come up, I use the iceberg analogy. Tip of the iceberg. Above the surface, what you and everybody can see is the imposter syndrome. And when people try to resolve the imposter syndrome with external things like when I get this certification, then I’ll be able to. It’s that when then kind of mode.
Jim: Right.
Melinda: But what’s really going on below the surface? What would you say is happening and driving the imposter syndrome? That if they could put their attention there, it’ll kind of, you know, just release all the needs for all this external chasing.
Jim: Yeah. So the imposter syndrome is rooted in a complete lack of self-confidence and low self-esteem. I’ve got another story that I think would help illustrate this. When I started coaching in 2009, I was fully aware of some really good coaches and what they were doing to build practices. When I started, I offered a group call at $97 plus a call with me for $197. My rates are nowhere near that. My highest program is $44,000 a year. It took me a while to get there.
Now I was growing and growing okay. But then, as I was feeling my oats, I’d have three or four different businesses, all successful. So I felt like my courage was expanding. But I had a very long held, like, fear of public speaking. I always managed my career not to get up in front of a whole room full of my peers and speak. Somehow, I did that. But now I’m like watching these other coaches present to a hundred or a thousand people instead of always one on one for your next client. But I was always going to find a way to go around that I’m going to be successful. I know that. But I’m going to not have to do that.
And one of the things I did is I joined a fairly high-end mastermind in which there were three very successful coaches. And here I am in this room. There’s about six people around this table, and one of them does like two to three million dollars a year of coaching. So my turn, I’m very nervous. I get up, say, here’s what I’m doing on the break. This gentleman comes up to me and he goes, Jim, it’s nice to have you here. I’ve admired what you’ve done with no hassle newsletters. But I have a question for you.
Now, you say you want to grow your coaching practice maybe as big as mine. I don’t know. But I’m aware of what you’re doing now to market your coaching business. But, Jim, I have a question for you. There’s some things I don’t see you willing to do. You think somehow, you’re entitled to achieve the same level of success, but you’re not willing to do these things. How does that work for you? Melinda? I turned fire engine red. I could feel my ears super-hot.
Melinda: Yeah? Yeah.
Jim: I was so embarrassed. And all I remember is I flew home from Philadelphia, five-hour flight, thinking I will never be in that position again. I’m a guy that doesn’t try one thing if it doesn’t work. I went all in. I joined Dale Carnegie, did Toastmasters. I went to a hypnotist. I started meditation and self-hypnosis. A year later, I had my first speaking gig in front of 30 people. I sucked at it, but two years later, I’m speaking to 400 doctors. I closed $40,000 of business in less than an hour. And then I created my own live event where I’m on stage for three days.
So I had to really kick that demon in the butt. And that’s what I mean success is all in. It’s not a la carte. You have to be willing to do the hard things, and that means kicking your fears. So why are people rooted in imposter syndrome? Because I didn’t want to be found out. I go to a networking event. I’m pretty good on my feet. I can extend a hand and have a conversation, but I could not get on that stage if my life depended on it. But I fixed that. And so having those fears holds you back. That’s what imposter syndrome is.
When you can eliminate reasons you feel like an imposter, you’re off to the races. So when you look at people who are highly successful versus people who are kind of at an average level of success, I guarantee they’re doing things that other people feel very uncomfortable doing.
Melinda: Yeah. You’ve shared some amazing stories. Can you walk us through a situation? You know, don’t reveal names and protect confidentiality, but can you walk us through a time where you coach someone through the imposter syndrome? Like, what was the root cause? How did you help them? What were the results?
Jim: I think in most cases, I try and do it without actually addressing that. In other words, I think of, what would I have wanted to hear when I did step up and had my first mentor when I’m helping somebody create a brand. And this is your book title podcast all that. This is where your offerings will be based under. It’s not just johnqsmith.com. It’s like the Marriage Healer or whatever it’s going to be. And that’s what we’re going to go with. And everything we talk about is on that example would be based on, you know, hi, I’m Jim. I’m the marriage healer. One of the ways I want to talk to you today is blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And there’s a. And just start giving and serving and serving and serving.
And in most cases, I say, don’t make every third line, your URL or your offer. You serve, serve, serve. And earn the right to ask or earn the right to promote. And maybe, you know, there’s an announcer at the end who says, to learn more about Jim the Marriage Healer, go here. And just enough people will do that if you come from a servant aspect. The thing that I’m doing with my clients is I’m getting them focused on serving their clients from an authentic position. But I give them a good brand and give them, you know, some good marketing to do that. And I think if I can get them to buy into the marketing or the brand, I help them create based on their skills, the imposter syndrome starts to go away.
One of the things I do, I’ve always done it on my coaching calls before we dive in. Tell me something good since last time we talked. What’s something really good that happened? A lot of times they’ll say, oh, I got a new client, and then they’ll move on. I said, wait a minute. Where did they come from? Were they referred? Find out if you don’t know. What was the first thing I said to you? Yes, Susan referred me and said you could help me with this. That’s what I want to know. What did Susan say in the referral? Because that’s really important.
Not only is it important to know how Susan sees your benefit, but you can now structure a little bit of the language you’re going to use on this preliminary phone call in that way. You’re not going to repeat it right in that 30 seconds, but 10 minutes into the call, one of the things I’m really good at is this. And I do that by blah, blah, blah. See what I mean? You can start weaving some of the things why they were referred to in the first place. So we’ll do that. I had a client who was a chiropractor, but also did functional medicine. Some of your audience may know what that is. She said, hey, Jim, I got a new client. They actually drove like three hours to see me.
And I’m like, there’s chiropractors like next to every Starbucks. How come they drove three hours to see you? And she said, somewhere on my website it says I practice functional medicine. I did a quick Google functional medicine and I put the name of her town or the city and I was like, do you know there’s like 3 million people searched Functional Medicine, slash Detroit, say in the last day or hour. I said, we got to redo your website and put Functional Medicine Detroit. We went all into that, rebranded her and things like that. But that’s, that’s one of the ways to do that, is when you can help people bring out their natural skills and understand the value they provide in a transformational way. Imposter syndrome melts away because you stop thinking about it anymore. You’re more excited about the value you’re going to bring to your clients and the difference you’re going to make in their lives.
Melinda: Yeah. Let’s look at another topic, and that’s the topic of pricing, how we price our services. So let’s talk about pricing imposter syndrome is this fear of being found out. Why do you think that’s a direct correlation to people charging low rates?
Jim: Well, when people start in business, they feel like they’ve got to get their foot in the door. I’ll be a little bit lower, either average or lower than other people doing what I do, and then I’ll grow from there. That’s not always a great place to be in, although I do understand cash flow mode versus regular, ongoing, growing business mode. But there’s two things that I believe can help people be handsomely rewarded for the value they’re providing.
Number one, I call it slowing down the sale. A lot of people may be attracted to you from your marketing, your website, your brand doing interviews like this, and they may want to work with you. And then they say in this initial call, they get all excited and want the whole enchilada. You know, they don’t want just this, and then we’ll do this. What would it be like to do this? And then you as a business owner, get excited. Wow, somebody really digs me. They want the whole enchilada.
So you give a price for the whole enchilada and they get sticker shock. And then what happens? Well, we don’t have to do this and we don’t have to do this. And now you’re peeling away the benefits, lowering the price, and they’re like, not really what I wanted, and you’ve lost the customer. Slowing down the sale means taking the whole enchilada and rolling it out in a certain way.
One of the ways to do that is the part B of this strategy that I call Fast Start. I am working with some marriage therapists right now who were not doing great. And I said, look, we know it’s going to take a year. It might take a couple of years for most, but what I want to do is offer a fast start, a 90 day Fast Start. There’s some things that we’re going to do over the next 90 days, which is going to give you breathing room and more than anything, a sense of hope that there is a 2.0 or the next stage. And I taught them to say, in reality, we’re probably going to work together for a year, maybe two. But that’s not prescribed. The only decision you have to make right now is are you willing to invest in the 90 day Fast Start to get you where you can breathe again and where you can see hope.
Now, Melinda, they’ve had great success with this Fast Start. I think they’re up to 15 people said yes. And most of those go through the 90 day Fast Start are continuing to work with this couple where a lot of therapists, they say, look, I charge weekly or monthly or quarterly. It’s going to take a year or two. And they’re seeing this big process. Chunk it down to where you can show results. In the coaching world, I work with a lot of coaches. I say the Fast Start would be whether they want more subscribers or they want to sell more programs. What can you do in a 90-day program? By doing the 90 day Fast Start program, you’re lowering the bar of entry because you’re only committing to 90 days.
And therefore you’re lowering the financial bar because you’re charging for 90 days. And then you serve your clients in an amazing fashion in 90 days. You deliver two to three times more value in 90 days than they’re actually investing with you. But you know what happens in 90 days? They know you; they trust you. You’ve developed rapport. And now what’s next? Because they’re saying, what’s next? And there’s nothing wrong with that. This is business. So slow down the sale. Come up with a fast start. Way to do that.
One thing I learned in my own coaching practice, I have three options. Good, better, best. You always Want your B and C option to be much higher price and far away. So my entry level program has always been platinum at $497amonth. It’s been that way for 10 years. And I know the value somebody gets at $497 is extraordinary. But I also know that half the people that stay with me for three or four years at the higher-level start at the $497 level. And six months into the $497, I will hear something to like. Jim, this is great. How do we go faster? How do we do more?
Let’s get you into diamond, where they weren’t ready to say diamond at the beginning. So slow down the sale, do some sort of fast start and serve, serve, serve and really deliver some amazing results. And your customer is going to want to step it up and go higher, go faster and stay with you longer. And by the way, they’re going to refer you more.
Melinda: Yeah, it’s an easy way to create those raving fans that don’t stop talking about you and bring their friends, family members to join in as well. And so when we look at the imposter syndrome and pricing, making sure that we put our attention in the right area, they just handle themselves. We don’t actually have to address imposter syndrome, but we have to look at what’s the root going on.
When we can put it in perspective like this and create the options and make the pricing about the potential clients’ experience. Like you said, slowing down the sale, helping them get acclimated to what the journey is going to be like, giving them a quick jumpstart for what they are capable and willing to do when we can make it about them and their experience and then we serve them to get results.
Jim: That’s right.
Melinda: That’s the key to all of this. It’s all about results. I mean, there’s so many businesses that don’t focus on results, they only focus on the sale. And that’s the biggest through line that I’ve heard in this conversation is focus on the results. Because when you do, when you serve in that way, everything else just melts away.
Jim: Yeah. And when your clients are getting amazing results, they’re not thinking about whether or not you got the degree. They’re thinking about, wow, Jim or Melinda is really helping me and I want to keep going. Right?
Melinda: Yeah.
Jim: You know, I’m retiring in December and I’ve had five of my current roster of clients say, what would it take to work with you next year? So, you know, that’s a good thing. And I’m proud of that. I’ve always practiced what I call no ripple effect. In my business, if somebody wasn’t happy with the newsletter program or weren’t happy with this, I did whatever I could to make that customer happy. If they couldn’t be happy, I made sure they left the building happy because I didn’t want any ripple effect.
To the best of my knowledge, you can’t find a bad review about me, which is pretty rare. For 25 years, I made sure that everybody I worked with got a great experience. Sometimes somebody comes under the radar. It’s oil and water. We’re not working. I. I will let them out of the contract. I’ll do what I can to make them happy. It’s usually not a refund, but we’ll stop the payments. By the way, if you ever change your mind, reach out to me. I’d be glad to help. I want people happy because I want no ripple effect in the water that’s going to disturb my business or my reputation.
Melinda: Yeah. Now, before we wrap up, is there a final piece of advice you might share with newer coaches struggling with imposter syndrome or pricing their services?
Jim: Okay, here’s the thing. You will earn significantly higher income for who you are than what you do. It really is about you, your brand, your reputation and what you bring to the table. So if you are a good coach, you better have a moniker and a brand that speaks to who you are with a very fine point. You need to be niched and understood that you’re the go to person in that niche so you’ll make infinitely more money for who you are than what you do. It’s about you.
Melinda: Love it. I love it. I love it. I love it. So let’s summarize some of the things that we’ve talked about today. I love how you kicked us off when you said thinking about what you do as transformation, not a task that just immediately shifts our perspective. And we talked about how people pay for transformation. That is really at the heart of it. We talked about the iceberg analogy and going below it. And you talked about the root really being, focusing on how we feel inadequate, that low self-esteem, the lack of self-confidence.
We got into the pricing and I love how you shared the two different options. You’ve got the slowing down the sale so that we don’t just have them jump in the deep end and get that sticker shock or they can’t see the value for what is happening. And then you talked about that fast start option as an entryway that leads to deeper, bigger transformations. And then I love what you just ended with. You’ll earn a significantly higher income for who you are, not what you do. Jim, any final parting words?
Jim: What a blast. This is actually my sign off interview, Melinda, so I’m glad it was on a coaching podcast and I owe it to my daughter, Jessica Rhodes, Interview Connections. She said, hey dad, I was just on a great show. I told you they should interview you. So I appreciate the recommendation from Jessica.
Melinda: Yeah, I’m glad you could be here and what an honor to be your send-off guest appearance. Thank you for listening to this episode of Just Between Coaches. Thank you to Jim Palmer for this incredible conversation. You can find out more about him getjimpalmer.com. That’s get G-E-T Jim Palmer P-A-L-M-E-R dot com. And in the show notes, you’ll find links to his website and he has generously made all of his Kindle versions of his books for free on his website, so you’ll find them there. Be sure to check it out.
I’m Melinda Cohan and you’ve been listening to Just Between Coaches. Just Between Coaches is part of the Mirasee Podcast Network, which also includes such shows as Making it and Neuroscience of Coaching. For more great episodes, follow us on Mirasee FM’s YouTube channel or your favorite podcast player. And if you enjoyed the show and want to help us spread the word, please leave us a five-star review and tell your friends. Thank you so much and we’ll see you next time.